[Pathfinder] Dragons

[Paidi tou Selini]

[ Character Sheets ]

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[ Premise/Foreword ]
Dragons have always been the big bad, pillaging the countryside or waiting patiently for brave adventurers to come and challenge them. But what of the dragons' perspective? Surely these intelligent leaders of the ancient world have not fallen so far? From deadly jokes to millenia of The Game, dragon culture is rich and expansive. This is your story. You are the apex predator. The time has come to claim your domain, assert your dominance, and most importantly build your hoard. But beware; being on the top has its own list of challenges. Great riches can draw greedy eyes, politics and rival kingdoms can threaten territory, minions can rebel, and other dragons roam the land. Do you have what it takes to earn a legend worthy of your great race?


[ Setting Information/Background ]
The world is young. Mortal races and their primitive kingdoms dot the landscape, rising and falling across the ages too fast for anyone important to keep track. The fae keep to their forests and caves, holding to ancient traditions established by their draconic and primordial superiors. The wildlands are mostly untamed and leylines of raw magical power branch freely from the great World Tree. The tree itself is protected by the World Eater, a legendary serpent that has fed off the World Tree's power for so long even the oldest of Great Wyrms dare not challenge it. The fae hold true to their ancient, dwindling pantheons and the mortals worship as many deities as there are stars, but the only gods that truly matter are Apsu (a.k.a: Bahamut) and Tiamat, the creators, and Dahak the destroyer.

Map and more details pending.


[ Game Introduction/Plot ]
A few votes for Option B left the poll even, but everyone seems to be building Chromatics and only one person spoke up for Option B, so I'm going to assume the popular vote was less even than the poll made it out to be. Perhaps I should have included an "I don't care" section for voters who don't actually want to play like I've seen other polls do... but anyway!

Option A: Conquest Mode - This will be a non-standard game utilizing pathfinder mass-combat mechanics alongside a few other wargame mechanics I've picked up through research. It will play out as a turn-based (probably with everyone taking their turns at once) affair, with instances playing out as either mass battles or more traditional encounters. You will be allowed to play any breed in the bestiary samples book listed below (in House Rules), and players are by no means obligated to cooperate with each other. Though neither are you obligated to be Evil and/or work against each other. Dragons are not defined by crass mortal alignments. You do what you please. Balance is obviously a work-in-progress seeing as this is the first time I've tried something like this. To that end player feedback is highly encouraged.

[ Character Creation ]



Available Sources: Pretty much anything on www.d20pfsrd.com or similar Pazio sites
Banned Resources: No homebrew, and I ask that you get permission before using any 3rd-party material

ECL: 8
Gold: 33,000 g
Races: Dragons, of course!
Ability Scores: 22 point buy.
Hit Points: Max at level 1, roll for every level after (reroll 1s once).
Alignments: Any
Pantheon: Standard. Optional unless taking levels in a divine class.
Backgrounds: Custom

[ House/Optional Rules ]

1] We will be using the Bestiary Race template found here, on page 29. You will get to choose your color based upon which campaign we run. Don't worry about choosing a "weaker" breed; as you can see in the template, power dispersity is fairly balanced. In either campaign you are welcome to take normal class levels whenever you wish. You may have to take this option if you gain a level and don't have enough age or treasure to take a dragon level. Also keep in mind that due to the accelerated time of these games (the longer you live, the faster time seems to pass, after all) there will be rules on sleeping to gain XP and age.
2] Pending  

[Xenar1]

Paidi tou Selini

Okay! First post updated with the so fars~ time to get into background and location.

All dragons start out the same. After you hatch you are either alone to begin with or almost immediately driven out of your mother's lair (some more violently than others). Life lessons are given upon the school of Hard Knocks, and your first few years serve as stark reminders of your primal origins. Some don't survive; others choose to remain as little more than beasts; but you are different. You learned that there was more to the world than food and slumber. Language and resources could be used to manipulate the simple-minded creatures around you, and the treasures they crafted were just as appealing as a warm meal. But they were also greedy and unpredictable. Treasure needed to be guarded, and food could be stored to allow you more time for intellectual pursuits. Before long you decided it was time to settle down and build a lair of your own. Where did you go?

• Plains - Whether an artificial structure standing on its own design or a burrow beneath the rolling hills, a lair out on the open fields is a bold risk. You receive a 25% boost to food and minion production, but all scouting and spying attempts as well as all invasions against you receive a +2 bonus.
  
• Forest - Natural caves and the ruins of ancient fae civilizations abound, creating ample opportunities for suitable disguise and defense. Scouting attempts and air invasions against you receive a -2 penalty, but your Random Event roll receives a -2 penalty to reflect the risk of living in fae lands.
  
• Mountain - Natural defenses are often a great start, and many of the more malleable races love dark, secluded caves. Spying attempts and land invasions against you receive a -2 penalty, but your Random Event roll receives a -2 penalty to reflect the risk of living in fae lands.
  
• Swamp - An extreme form of forest, these nature-claimed locales make sure artificial structures do not stand and natural defenses remain difficult to maintain, but make up for it by the fact that no sane race would wish to venture here. All spying and scouting attempts as well as all invasions against you receive a -2 penalty, but all lair and minion expenses are 10% greater.
  
• Island - An extreme form of mountain, these secluded paradises are highly defensible and provide nearly everything a budding domain needs. All spying attempts receive a -2 penalty and land invasions receive a -5 penalty, but minion production is reduced by 25% to reflect the limited space.
  
• Desert - An extreme form of plains, this inhospitable landscape takes everything its lush cousin has and turns it on its head. In addition, the shifting sands makes natural burrows impossible. All spying and scouting attempts as well as all invasions against you receive a -2 penalty, but food and minion production is reduced by 25%.
  
  - Frozen - *Keyword modifier. Not all locations are geographically ideal. The environments in the northern and southern lands can occasionally suffer from harsher weather than most. Anything with the Frozen keyword applies a -1 penalty to scouting and invasions, but 10% reduced food and minion production.
  - Tropical - *Keyword modifier. Residing near the center of the map brings about more lush and prosperous locations, but the closer one gets to the World Tree the more dangerous things become. Anything with the Tropical keyword applies a 10% bonus to food and minion production, but receives a -1 penalty to their Random Event roll.

FAQ and MISC

Okay... now let's see if I can cover things as they've come up. If I miss anything let me know.


Yes, skill points are gained retroactively upon Intelligence mod boosts. Makes things a WHOLE lot easier to keep track of. From an RP standpoint you can think of it more like gaining an epiphany and finding your talent for certain skills drastically increasing.

Pathfinder is basically 3.75. If you know 3.5 well you should be able to pick up Pathfinder in a snap. In addition to the things iNTENT listed the only "hidden" difference that stood out (to me at least) was that you no longer put half-points into non-class skills. 1 point = 1 skill for everything, and you get additional bonuses for putting a point in a class skill.

I see two votes for Metallic but only one person talking about wanting to play a traditional campaign. Though on your comments specifically, Ms. VulgarUnicorn, I get the feeling you'll like Option A better anyway. Though alignments aren't as concrete in this world, The Game is still pretty exclusively a Chromatic thing. Maybe some Metallics might be ambitious enough to join (to the same extent that I'm allowing Metallics to join the A game), but certainly not any Chosen of Apsu, which is basically what Option B was centering around.

It's funny you should mention that, since I chose Bronze, Silver, and Gold because they were the only breeds that could shapeshift naturally. But like iNTENT pointed out, all dragons get spell levels as if they were Sorcerers at some point during adulthood, so you can still shapeshift even without the spell-like ability those three breeds get.

I will allow more than 5 people into Conquest Mode since I have rules about not posting in time, so if that's the consensus (which it's looking like it is) I guess I'll update the first page with Option A specifics soon. Maybe tomorrow, just in case more people want to speak up against the idea (I'm looking at you, mysterious voter #3).

1) Yup, Traps are pretty perfect emulations of lair wards.

2) What you see is what you get with spells. If you truly want to emulate a lesser race for more than a few minutes (/*talktothedragonhand*) we can arrange for you to research or purchase a magical item with Change Shape as a spell-like ability. Lots of fun little strategies you can use with that so I don't want to deny non-Bronze/Silver/Golds the opportunity if they so desire.

Quote:

Though neither are you obligated to be Evil and/or work against each other. Dragons are not defined by crass mortal alignments.

with this in mind does one really need to pick between options? (oh, and option A)

edit: and what about imperial and primal dragons? they might not fit neatly into the story though sweatdrop

i'll be a red or white though, haven't decided which yet.  

[Paidi tou Selini]

iLL iNTENT

Thank you for the offer and interest. 3nodding If this is what the majority consensus ends up pointing towards you are more than welcome to critique my Conquest Mode design when I post it.

Xenar1

That is a very fair question. Now that I've looked at things a little more closely I could probably be tempted to allow Metallic breeds into Conquest Mode. Based on my own logic they really wouldn't complicate things as much as I first thought they might.

Imperials and Primals are a different story, though. As you can see, only a Crystal has been listed in that book, and I'm not entirely comfortable adding the extra complication of homebrew breeds on top of everything else I'm already trying to balance. Maybe if we feel adventurous for round 2, but I'd rather see a successful round 1 first.  

[Xenar1]

Lokiizjun
Female neutral Chromatic Dragon, White dragon, Level 1, Init +3, HP 13/13, Speed 60, bur30, swim60
AC 15, Touch 15, Flat-footed 12, Fort +3, Ref +5, Will +2, Base Attack Bonus 1
+full str bite 5 (1d4+2, X2)
+1/2 str 2 claws 5 (1d3+1/1d3+1, X2)
(+3 Dex, +2 Size)
Abilities Str 14, Dex 17, Con 12, Int 11, Wis 10, Cha 8
Condition name: Lok (sky) Iiz (ice) Jun (king)

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as I was making this a thought occurred. these are monsters when it comes to 'class' so should we use only monster feats?

and another thought came to items and equipment. I can see a dragon wearing barding if the material was harder than it's scales. but i'm guess most of our wealth will go into our empires.....  

[Mongooseh]

Somewhat interested.  

[Paidi tou Selini]

Nah. You can take standard class levels so I see no reason not to let you take standard feats. On the same token you are welcome to take monster feats as well.

Most of your wealth will go into whatever you want. As with most war games I'm incorporating a number of different paths to victory. Want to have a small cult and put all your wealth into making yourself an independant threat? Go for it. Want to build up a strong economy and conquer with an impressive army? More power to you. Want to play a wise-cracking Green or Copper who wins the hearts of the mortals through Diplomacy? The challenge is yours.

Pathfinder has rules for sticking armor on abnormally sized/shaped creatures. As long as you nab the proficiency feats (or take a level in a class with proficiency) you can take to the battlefield in full plate if you so desire. Probably won't earn you much respect among other dragons, but I imagine it would look pretty cool.  

[Xenar1]

iLL iNTENT

Also, Paidi, are you at all familiar with the 3.5 book, Draconomicon? If not, you might want to look into it. Though it's not a Pathfinder book, there IS a wealth of information in there regarding how to handle dragons in campaigns, both as enemies the PCs fight, and for having them as player characters. It could be a hefty source of inspiration.

hefty isn't the word for it. it's a 300 page monstrosity devoted to dragons xp


it did give me some ideas though for lair building pirate  

[WhimsicalXellos]

Here's a base sheet for Luukalarenolydas, my green dragon. You can call him Luuk only if he respects you.  

[Paidi tou Selini]

Yup. I'm using the Draconomicon from 3.5 and 4e as reference guides. Still don't really like the idea of allowing non-Pathfinder materials yet, but yes, they do make great reference materials.

Yes, the bestiary has a few mistakes. In a few breeds it lists "-1 Size Bonus if Gold Consumed for growth." This should still be -1 to AC like the others.

ECL for Conquest Mode will be 8. Could potentially have a lv 1 Prologue for people to get used to the characters, but I'll leave that up to popular demand.