Anyone Up For Middle-Earth?

[Laelless]

2_phatian

Then why not eliminate the magic classes altogether, and have the only magical class be the Artificer from Eberron? It is a class that specializes in creation and use of magical items.

Though that would destroy my idea, but ah well I can still create another.

I may just do that.
Again, all this is still in planning.
Sorry everyone, but I have my hands full with midterms, so gimme a few days.
xD  

[Disciple of Sakura]

Arc Vembris

2_phatian

Wizards only to elves? May I ask what was the guy with white hair and staff then? I thought he was human...

That's what he wants you to think.

No, Gandalf was a DMPC. So was everyone else aside from the hobbits and Boromir, to be honest. It was a really rail-roady campaign.

Though, TBH, I'd say that Paladins exist. They may call Aragorn a "ranger," but an awful lot of what he really does is straight up paladin stuff. Lay on Hands, Smite Evil...  

[Laelless]

Disciple of Sakura

Arc Vembris

2_phatian

Wizards only to elves? May I ask what was the guy with white hair and staff then? I thought he was human...

That's what he wants you to think.

No, Gandalf was a DMPC. So was everyone else aside from the hobbits and Boromir, to be honest. It was a really rail-roady campaign.

Though, TBH, I'd say that Paladins exist. They may call Aragorn a "ranger," but an awful lot of what he really does is straight up paladin stuff. Lay on Hands, Smite Evil...

I see him more as a crusader or a plain old fighter, actually. But thats my deal. The trouble I'm having with the divine classes is that the Valor aren't really involved in mortal affairs. Thats what Gandalf and the other wizards were there for.  

[Laelless]

Seph Baelzara

I could easily see him as a Crusader, Gimli a Warblade, and Legolas as a Swordsage with REALLY high Dexterity.
But I wouldn't put any of them above level 5; and that's pushing it... Gandalf, afterall, was a 5th level Wizard

Interestingly enough, there are alot of debates about Gandalf's power level. (Me, being biased, believe its over 9000.)
Some claim that since he is an angel, or a magical one at least, his true power is not really shown. However, others argue, like in your link, that he is actually not very strong. According to the Silmarillion, Gandalf and the other wizards can actually pose a threat to Sauron, but since Sarumons betrayal, and the disappearance of the other two, they don't.

Although there is a lack of evidence, so despite how much it pains me, Gandalf isn't that powerful in terms of magical destruction.
His diplomacy and fighting abilit,y however, are through the roof.
And he's a badass.  

[Wrasynth Ksyamen]

legit.

Idunno I'd like to join but, I feel bad for saying this considering hur oc is in another campaign in this guild as we speak but I sincerely feel like I don't get to play him enough ._. every time something happens. Still it would be compelling and challenging, Hur' Oc would be Uruk Hai descendant after Sauron's and Sauramon's influence have long since gone away. Meaning those that did survive would have to try and find their own niche in the world. Although if he wasn't careful I'm suspecting swift brutal death and lots of hiding his face for his dear life. Seeing as how the dwarves would prolly try to kill him on sight, the elves would try to kill him on sight, and depending on the human... might try to kill him on sight.

That or Hur' Oc's going to have to be the most charming orc on the face of middle earth.


Otherwise I could just play Bjorn Johanes. Rohirrim warrior and the like. Also I imagine the actual orc population has taken a massive nose dive as something like 100k of them die?  

[Laelless]

Seph Baelzara

Laelless

Seph Baelzara

I could easily see him as a Crusader, Gimli a Warblade, and Legolas as a Swordsage with REALLY high Dexterity.
But I wouldn't put any of them above level 5; and that's pushing it... Gandalf, afterall, was a 5th level Wizard

Interestingly enough, there are alot of debates about Gandalf's power level. (Me, being biased, believe its over 9000.)
Some claim that since he is an angel, or a magical one at least, his true power is not really shown. However, others argue, like in your link, that he is actually not very strong. According to the Silmarillion, Gandalf and the other wizards can actually pose a threat to Sauron, but since Sarumons betrayal, and the disappearance of the other two, they don't.

Although there is a lack of evidence, so despite how much it pains me, Gandalf isn't that powerful in terms of magical destruction.
His diplomacy and fighting abilit,y however, are through the roof.
And he's a badass.

Weren't the Istari (or was it Maia?) bound to keep to "shadows" and not directly interfere with the mortal races? Being that most of the time Gandalf was with either the Races of Man, Dwarves, Elves or Hobbits, he was forced to keep his power in check. Yet when he was faced with another Maia (Balrog) and Istari (Saruman) he was able to go full out.
So while I'll bow to the theory that Gandalf was, indeed, over a "level 5 wizard" in a few select cases. But in about 90% of the stage time that Gandalf had, he was a very persuasive, verbose, fairly weak, spellcaster.
I'm not even going to touch Gandalf the White... That's a whole different story.

Indeed.
It pains me to admit that he was such a sorry spellcaster. ;-; I love casters. You have no argument from me on regards of his spellcasting abilities, cause I would've loved to see Gandalf take out a group of Orcs with a lazily thrown fireball while he shoved his staff up Saruman's a**. But at least he is still one of the coolest old guys ever, considering his other skills.  

[Chieftain Twilight]

you guys and others are basing his magical ability primarilly on the visual display and how they align to the the visual displays of D&D Magic System. and while the D&D Magic System has been based primarilly on real-world traditions, as well as common Folklore, tooled to be balanced in-game, the entire way Magic functions in the LOTR is completely different.

it's based on Philosophy and Theological Ideology. primarily the Willpower, Words of Power, and Strength of Spirit. entirely different from D&D's Esoteric/Occultic basis for Wizardry (Spellbooks, Alchemical Formulae, Imagination, and Raw Components).

the fact that Gandalf's Magic wasn't so "powerful" was because, for the most part, Magic wasn't very dramatically world-bending like it is in D&D. it was a manipulation that few knew the Secrets to perform, and even if they did, some of it was just not possible for just anyone. it was almost ENTIRELY Wisdom-based, none of it Intelligence-based, regardless of whether it was Arcane or Divine (and indeed, much of it couldn't be classified as one over the other). sure, there'd be plenty which should have rightly been Charisma-based, but none of it was Intelligence-based.

furthermore, the actual damage or effects of some of his other Spells, primarilly in the later ends of the story (such as what looked like Searing Light as he and Pippin rode into Pelanor) would have surely been for extremely high Caster-Level to provoke the reactions that they did. and he DID have access to what would have been 6th-level or higher Divination Spells. truely, I think Gandalf was a Multiclass Wizard(or Sorcerer)/Cleric, possibly Mythic Theurge, in addition to being a Celestial. his ECL would have been very high, and by al rights should be Epic in D&D.

this is all why I think that you cannot so easily stick Gandalf in such a rediculously low level-bracket. >.>  

[Chieftain Twilight]

Seph Baelzara

So many fallacies...

Chieftain Twilight

you guys and others are basing his magical ability primarilly on the visual display and how they align to the the visual displays of D&D Magic System. and while the D&D Magic System has been based primarilly on real-world traditions, as well as common Folklore, tooled to be balanced in-game, the entire way Magic functions in the LOTR is completely different.

Except that D&D is based on fantasy worlds such as the LotR-verse.

it realy is not, actually. it's based primarilly on Pagan Traditions, Occultic Folklore, and Dark Age History.

Quote:

the fact that Gandalf's Magic wasn't so "powerful" was because, for the most part, Magic wasn't very dramatically world-bending like it is in D&D. it was a manipulation that few knew the Secrets to perform, and even if they did, some of it was just not possible for just anyone. it was almost ENTIRELY Wisdom-based, none of it Intelligence-based, regardless of whether it was Arcane or Divine (and indeed, much of it couldn't be classified as one over the other). sure, there'd be plenty which should have rightly been Charisma-based, but none of it was Intelligence-based.

Quote:

A person with high Wisdom can be very verbose, and sound intelligent and charismatic with the use of complex words, a charismatic person can sound intelligent with the use of many words. It's all a matter of perception, really.

your semantics are circular, and don't change a damn thing. now your just being a p***k.

Quote:

furthermore, the actual damage or effects of some of his other Spells, primarilly in the later ends of the story (such as what looked like Searing Light as he and Pippin rode into Pelanor) would have surely been for extremely high Caster-Level to provoke the reactions that they did. and he DID have access to what would have been 6th-level or higher Divination Spells. truely, I think Gandalf was a Multiclass Wizard(or Sorcerer)/Cleric, possibly Mythic Theurge, in addition to being a Celestial. his ECL would have been very high, and by al rights should be Epic in D&D.

Quote:

Specifically why I wouldn't touch Gandalf the White. We know very little about him, and his powers. Clearly there was a jump in level and spellcasting, but hardly enough evidence to support any kind of specific "level." What most people think of Gandalf, is "the Gray," which is what the article talks about in length. Seeing as there's at least two, if not three, solid books that go into what Gandalf the Gray can do. I suggest you read it.

and ya know what? this brings up another point... why the ******** are we even discussing Gandalf, be he Grey OR White? the proposed campaign is after all the Maia go away to Valinor forever anyway!

Quote:

this is all why I think that you cannot so easily stick Gandalf in such a rediculously low level-bracket. >.>

When using Gandalf the White? Sure. He's not a 5th level Wizard. Which is the basis of your argument.

actually, the basis of my argument went beyond the argument of his level, and to the fact that you can't base his abilities in D&D terms so easily and directly, which was the very first point I made. not that I can honestly convince you when you are already convinced that I'm mistaken about that entire point anyway.  

[Chieftain Twilight]

Seph Baelzara

So... if we agree to disagree all will be good, yes?

aye, that oughta do it. xp  

[Laelless]

Gandalf > Anything Else