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 Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:07 pm
GreenInkling Rei Torano Ma ne, But people are still animals. We just happen to talk and have been successful enough to make things that work. I don't really believe the whole dominion bit because Animals still kill and eat people (with a lot more sense. Kill to eat and defend. Nothing complicated.). Either way.. >>; it's one of those thing I guess. Some don't consider people animals. That changes the whole outlook. confused >~< *nods*.... To the question! I liked your paragraph about the false alternative thing. In situations like that, there are actually a crap load of doable options when you think quickly and rationally. ------------- If I, too, play by the rules of the question, a few things are possible: I would selflessly give myself up because when I die, I'll go to heaven. (Boo yeh!) Once my friends were safe, I may fight for my life in an escape plan I somehow thought up. x3 I would go if one of my friends chose my previous. I'd feel darn awful, but I'd honor their sacrifice. Hopefully, God would save their hides somehow with some prayer. D; I would stay with them and make up a plan to kill this....son of a dog!...*ahem* with the three of us Macguiver-style. D;< How was that? Anything else to add?
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Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2009 5:17 pm
LuvTyler13 GreenInkling Grabbed your booty, Luv!
Officially, I have the boring answer of: none of the above. The question you asked is dubbed in some philosophy circles as "the false alternative" question. That is, in any give situation, it is statiscly impossible for there to be literally two either/or choices. There is always a third (and usually a fourht, fifth, sixth, etc.) choice. See your favorite action movie to get the idea of how this works.
But I'll play along with the question. I would hope I would chose myself. That would be the only right thing to do. Unless, there are unknown details about one person that would make it morally wrong for me to allow that person to live over myself and the other captive. But that's getting into really tricky moral theology. xp
Woo! Thank you! Hope it gave you lots of gold heart
Yes... I thought of this question because the show really made me... upset? So it stuck with me for awhile. The tricky part is when you include the sensory deprivation. If left to deal with that for too long, you literally start to loose you mind. (In retrospect, this can be an unfair question since we all have our minds intact! xd )
I guess what I am really after, is your reaction to this whole situation. Does that make sense?
Oh yeah, it's definently an upsetting scenario, no bones about it. I'm not sure what I would really do because I've never been put in such a situation, and I hope I never will!
It's really important, though, when someone tries to bully into choosing one of two options, neither of which you like, that you remember the "false alternative" trick. A lot of people try to condone some really horrible things using that logic, and the truth of the situation is that you just don't have to choose.
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Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 5:08 am
If I were a less moralistic person- I'd say it would have to depend on a number of things. Do I lik one person better then theh other? Are they conscious enough to realize I am indeed trying to kill them.
What if one of them had a terminal illness and was going to die anyway? (Instance of AIDS or something.) Thus I would probably humanely kill said person.
'course...I have some morals. I couldn't kill either one. I just wonder if they are as moralistic and see through it as I am. THAT is the question. (Gotta love paranoia...)
D: Was this prompted by the freaking Saw Movies? (Gods..it's getting old..)
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Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 11:24 am
xD Your thinking on that one is kinda scary, Rei. Saw definitely did that to you...
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Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 2:26 pm
I love reading all of your answers!! And no, it is not from a Saw movie.. I have actually never seen even one of those movies (they seem dumb to me). The idea came to me when I saw an episode of Criminal Minds.
Anyway, I had a follow up question.
After the guy had kidnapped these girls, told them they had a choice, and then they said they chose. They had made the choice to kill a girl who was sick (not seriously sick, but sick enough for them). They had finally broke down after 4-5 days, and chose.
The question is, what would you do (again). Except this time, after telling the guy they chose, he used a trap door to give them 2 hammers. (meaning, they/you would have to kill the third person yourself). What now?
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Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 7:53 pm
Oh, I was just talking about Rei's last answer. x3
Those movies seem ridiculous and scary. D:
I would use those hammers to bust out! I couldn't kill one of them because of morals and sentiment. They would have to kill me before I killed them...I think.
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Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2009 8:18 pm
Ma ne, the Movies aren't scary to me. The first, second and third were. The fourth was vaguely interesting- but in all I got -bored- by the whole thing.
Honestly, I was more afraid by Kowai Onna's Rattle Rattle.
o-o*Should totally do movie night!*
XD; It's October after all~ kukuku...I'm sooo letting you guys see all my favorite horror movies~ (And most are Pg-13 and up.)
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Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:18 am
O_o...I think I'll pass. I hate horror movies. >~< The scariest one I have willingly watched is Disturbia...and I know it wasn't near scary...
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Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 1:53 pm
Honestly, I don't think I would do it. I would be deliberatly responsible for the other person's death if I were taking the hammer and killing her myself. Whereas, with the first scenario, I would be responsible for her death by omition. I would assume she was going to die but it wouldn't be a certainty - there could still be chance for escape or change of the situation. Also, I know that if I made the decision to kill another person with a sound mind, knowing it to be wrong, I'd be endangering my mortal soul. At least, that's my theological perspective.
So short answer, no I wouldn't do it, I hope.
The best real-life example of this scenario is Saint Maximillian Kolbe, a priest during World War II. He was taken to a concentration camp where they randomly pulled people out and murdured them to make an example for the other prisoners. Fr. Kolbe saw that they chose a Jewish man who had a family, so he volunteered to go in his place. The prison guard wasn't convinced until Fr. Kolbe told him he was a priest because they got raises for killing priests. So they put Fr. Kolbe and a bunch of Jewish men in a cell and starved them to death. Saint Maximillion had them all singing Christian hymns and praying prayers until they died. He was the last to die. They eventually had to kill him with an injection.
I only saw the first Saw, and I liked it a lot. But when I saw they were coming out with number six, I was a bit surprised. It totally missed four and five. Where did they go?
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Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 4:54 pm
Oh, my. How selfless of that man... sad A martyr, or no?
Saw scares me...*shudder*
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Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 6:13 pm
Beh Saw one and two were alright because in the second it continues where the first left off and you learn that he has an apprentice In the Third the apprentice is the one that's actually being tested of course the guy from the first three movies is dead at this point.
Then in the fourth, it continues with new set and you learn that there's someone carrying it out. I think in the fifth movie you find out who and it turns out to be the cop. (I THINK) I barely remember it.
But to be honest. It's not -scary-. Just..vaguely disturbing and gross. First three- I was cool with it. The last two I wish they ..would stop and give up.
The guy's dead. What's the -point- now? DX;
But yeah, Kowai Onna is the best movies ever. I loved Rattle Rattle because it scared me at the end. It was highly interesting. It wasn't insanely gross. It wasn't extremely violent (From what I remember) It was creepy in ghost stories kind of way.
Suicide Club was interesting because of how it ends. It isn't what everyone really thought it was. The message...well. it's up for who you think it is.
And then... well I could totally go on and on. There's a LOT of good horror movies that aren't scary persay but have a good story to it.
Hansel and Gretal was one of these. It's not scary. (At least I wouldn't consider it scary. Then again to me this story's kinda like..a child's ghost story to me.) It's just sad though but it has a happy ending.
It's ..seriouslly good...;3; *Yes, I did cry dammits.*
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Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 6:37 pm
LuvTyler13
I love reading all of your answers!! And no, it is not from a Saw movie.. I have actually never seen even one of those movies (they seem dumb to me). The idea came to me when I saw an episode of Criminal Minds.
Anyway, I had a follow up question.
After the guy had kidnapped these girls, told them they had a choice, and then they said they chose. They had made the choice to kill a girl who was sick (not seriously sick, but sick enough for them). They had finally broke down after 4-5 days, and chose.
The question is, what would you do (again). Except this time, after telling the guy they chose, he used a trap door to give them 2 hammers. (meaning, they/you would have to kill the third person yourself). What now?
Hmm.. Seeing as I actually -do- have moral fiber, I'd use the hammers to find a way out or pretend to 'kill ' the other person have him in a false sense of security and beat him until he passes out if/when he comes to investigate. Anyway. Had I been objective- same outcome. Not because of moral fiber or any fear of mortal soul - but because I'd be a spiteful person. The trick is- always- finding the right things to say to a crazy person. Sympathize and blah.. << Hopefully they'll fall for it. Though, lets say I lacked that too- so... Yeah I'd totally kill the sick one. Even if she could've been saved- she would've slowed us down could be caught and..yeah.
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Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:14 pm
Okay, the whole Saw thing confused me. Please, don't even try because I'm never watch them. xD I hate bloody gore stuff that doesn't have to do with wars at least...*shudder*
Your answer still scares me near the end. "Survival of the fittest" for you. x) What if you were the sick one, eh??...
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Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:29 pm
Well it's the truth. It's pretty much everywhere you look in nature. It's logical that humans also will -think- of it first before deciding if it's worthwhile or not- ie: I shouldn't do that/think that because it's wrong.
I mean, what does the predator go after first? Healthy prey or weak/young prey? Weak and young are easier. But generally it's which ever one is closest and more accessible.
If I was the weak one- I would be terrified and hopefully pass out before the pain gets too bad and die.
Of course, unless on of the others-or both- are on the moral high ground. It would also have to be how ill I was to be thinking of such thoughts. If I was delirious out of my head sick- then I probably wouldn't know much.
Then again, they could be saving me from a slow painful death too. Dunno about you, but I don't like the idea of slowly dying in an extremely painful way- being sickly in such a place is painful.
Buuuuut
D: That's just me thinking a bit objectively.
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Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2009 7:56 pm
True, true. And hmmm...>_>
Why would you really wanna go after the healthy one, unless you wanted a real challenge of dominance or whatever...Just take the easier one...(aka: I agree.)
Slowly losing energy and the ability to breathe versus quick BAM and you're in the next world...Tough...=__= *thinks a lil'*
Good points. Touché. D:
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